Seeking Advice about a 1966 Savage 110CL

[Cgraham97]

Hello!

My uncle found this Savage 110CL 30-06 in a gun collection he purchased a few years ago. Because I am the only lefty in the family, he sold it to me for next to nothing. I have had a time and a half trying to get it to group well. I’ve tried different ammo companies, bullets, and grain weights. I’ve double checked the torque specs on the scope base and rings and have even bedded the action. Outside a couple good groups, the rifle consistently shoots 1.5-2” groups at 100 yards. Since left handed rifles can be hard to come by and finding one that performs well at a decent price can be more difficult, I’ve decided to turn this into a project rifle. My goal is to build a do-it-all hunting solution for 400 yards and in with an emphasis on accuracy, simplicity, and shootability. I live in NC and primarily hunt whitetails, however we are currently planning on heading out west to do some pronghorn hunting over the next year or two with a long term goal to go elk hunting.

Currently, the rifle is set up as follows:
Trigger - stock trigger adjusted to 2.5lbs
EGW Picatinny rail (0 moa built in)
Burris Signature Zee rings
Vortex Eagle 4-16x44 scope
Unloaded, the rifle weighs 8.5lbs


I have a few questions regarding barrel swap, caliber change, and potential stock upgrades that I would love to get some advice. If it would be easier to post these individually in separate threads, I am happy to do so.


Regarding Barrel Change:

- I am currently leaning towards a Shilen Stainless Match barrel from NSS.

- Does anyone know what barrel profile they offer that would be comparable to the barrel profile that is currently on the rifle?

- I have seen that they offer precision machined barrel nuts and recoil lugs. For those who have done barrel swaps, how impactful do you think these are in affecting the accuracy results?

- What are the pros/cons of the 6 groove vs 4 groove ratchet rifling they offer?


Regarding Potential Caliber Swap:

Currently, the options I have narrowed down to are: keeping it in 30-06, 270 Win, or 280AI. Each has their own pros/cons.

30-06 - Its reputation speaks for itself in terms of its terminal capability. I am a smaller guy and in this current configuration I get knocked around a bit by the rifle. It would be nice to have a rifle that is easier to shoot and manage recoil with.

270 Win. - Seems to offer a solution to some of the recoil, however I do wonder about the terminal capabilities on Elk. I have read many people who say it is perfectly adequate, however I don’t want to save up all the points to go on a hunt and find myself under-gunned. It would be interesting to have a conversation about building a fast twist 270 to handle some of the newer heavy bullets coming out in that diameter.

280 AI - I love the performance on paper the cartridge offers however I am not a reloader and factory ammunition is harder to find and much more expensive.


Stock options:

Ideally, I would love to eventually place this rifle into a polymer stock with an internal blind magazine and an adjustable cheek weld.

- I have read that some people will remove the bottom of these detachable magazines and insert the magazine body into the rifle and use the floor plate built into the stock as the new magazine base plate. Just curious if anyone has ever done this and what their experience was?

- What are some stock options you would recommend? From what I can tell, Boyds seems to be one of the few manufacturers that offer a stock that fits this version of the 110.

If you have made it this far, thank you so much for reading! This has been a fun project so far. Any advice or feedback would be much appreciated! I’m new to the world of customizing bolt action rifles and am excited to see what this rifle could turn into.

 

[ONE-TEN]

While I would enjoy answering all your questions. I simply speak on the first bit & leave the rest for other voices.

To start, 1.5-2” consistently is not terrible for an older Savage. The consistency and sheer age of the rifle, indicate it’s due to the barrel. Very likely a worn throat. A new PreFit barrel is the answer. I chose a Shilen for my first barrel as well. I now use a Criterion. BOTH are exceptional choices! As are several others. The Shilen will serve you well. Sporter or Heavy Sporter, either is close enough to the existing. I’d recommend heavier if shooting is all you will be doing. But if hunting is on the agenda, I’d go with a Sporter if I’m walking or a heavy Sporter if shooting from a blind.

Your cartridge choices are all superb. Each one will down any animal in North America with extreme prejudice! LOL! Honestly, go with your gut. Personally, I reload, so I would choose 280AI as it gives the most from reloading, between the three. But again, it’s a question only you can answer.

As for the new, machined Barrel Nut & Recoil Lug, they are not needed, but I would strongly recommend doing them. Quite frankly, putting a brand New, premium Shilen Select Match Barrel on with the old B.Nut & Lug, is like buying an expensive new scope, and mounting it using JUNK mounts & Scope Rings! I hate seeing this! The machined B.Nut & Lug are not very expensive. They don’t add a a whole lot to the price point. It just makes sense to buy new ones that match the barrel. You’ll be happy you did in the end.

 

[KMW1954]

The beauty of the Savage rifle is that there is not much one cannot do to it.

The prefit barrels are relatively inexpensive and are so easy to change. I have a Model 11 action that has had 4 different barrels on it at one time or another. Including, 243 it came with, 2 different 223 and now a 6ARC. It now wears a Boyd's At-One stock.

Through Gun Shack I was able to obtain boltheads to cover all 3 of the current popular calibers also at very reasonable prices.

Of the Boyd's stocks they do not tell you but do not use the recommended torque values for the action screw. Over torquing these screws will cause lamination issues.

 

[CFJunkie]

I have had great results with NSS and with Shilen Select Match barrels. James at NSS will help you pick what is best for your purpose.
My .223 has the 6-groove rifling and shoots great.
My 6.5mm has normal rifling and also shoots great.
I'm not sure the rifling really makes much of a difference. I think my shooter induced variations make any rifling contributions moot.
The range reports forum has several examples of how great both barrels shoot from a bench.

ONE-TEN has great advice.
I would go with the SS lug and barrel nut as well. I did that on both of my Shilen Select Match barrels.
When you have a beautiful 416R SS barrel, the SS lug and barrel nut just complete the picture.
Since I shoot targets from a bench, I went with full bull 26 and 28-inch barrels on a .223 and 6.5mm CM respectively.
I have mounted both of my Savages on MDT chassis. They also add weight and would be cumbersome for hunting.
MDT as set ups for hunting, but I have no experience with those stocks.
The full bull barrels are too heavy to be lugging around on a hunt, but are incredibly accurate on the bench.

 

[SevenFan]

See next post...

 

[SevenFan]

That's a nice survivor, I'd be inclined to retain its originality and find something else to modify but it's your rifle not mine.

Since 1966 was the transition year for the 110 and the serial number appears to be 101XXX which is pretty low, post a pic of the bolt removed from the action. This is the simplest way to confirm whether pre or post 66 and it matters immensely with respect to aftermarket barrel and stock options.

Curious how you determined year of manufacture. Through 1966 it required the barrel code which was an oval circle with 2 digits and a letter. The digits were the inspector's ID (meaningless for dating a rifle) the letter was the year code and identified year of production.

Here are the year codes thru 1966...

I - 1957
J - 1958
K - 1959
L - 1960
M - 1961
N - 1962
P - 1963
R - 1964
S - 1965
T - 1966

 

[ONE-TEN]

Here are the Dare codes through 1970.



I’ll add to KMW’s response. He’s not kidding about the Savage 110 NOT having much a limit on modifications. My rig is sheer proof of that. Hard pressed to find one more highly customized. (I’m picky!)

 

[CFJunkie]

In response to your recoil concerns, I'm not sure moving to a .270 would be any different.
My older hunting rifles are .30-06 and 0.270 Win.
I don't think the recoil between the .30-06 and the .270 are all that different with the same weight bullets.
The .270 shoots up to 150 gr bullets but the .30-06 shoots bullets up to and over 210 grs. Mine performed best with bullets 175 grs and heavier.
In my experience, the bullet weight makes more of a difference in felt recoil than the caliber. Rifle weight also makes a difference, but I always wanted my hunting rifles to be light enough to lug around when hunting.
My .30 cals were tame wrt recoil with 150 gr bullets, but I really knew I was shooting something when I shot 195 gr through 210 gr bullets.

Now that I am about to turn 83 and weigh less than 145 lbs., I even notice recoil with my 6.5mm CMs and I thought they were recoil pussycats 10 years ago.

 

[Cgraham97]

That's a nice survivor, I'd be inclined to retain its originality and find something else to modify but it's your rifle not mine.

Since 1966 was the transition year for the 110 and the serial number appears to be 101XXX which is pretty low, post a pic of the bolt removed from the action. This is the simplest way to confirm whether pre or post 66 and it matters immensely with respect to aftermarket barrel and stock options.

Curious how you determined year of manufacture. Through 1966 it required the barrel code which was an oval circle with 2 digits and a letter. The digits were the inspector's ID (meaningless for dating a rifle) the letter was the year code identified year of production.

Here are the year codes thru 1966...

I - 1957
J - 1958
K - 1959
L - 1960
M - 1961
N - 1962
P - 1963
R - 1964
S - 1965
T - 1966

Yes it shows a “T” on the barrel and has the newer bolt head design!

 

[Cgraham97]

Here are the Dare codes through 1970.



I’ll add to KMW’s response. He’s not kidding about the Savage 110 NOT having much a limit on modifications. My rig is sheer proof of that. Hard pressed to find one more highly customized. (I’m picky!)

I think my biggest concern with customizing this one is with options for replacement stocks. Any clarity on what options there are for me would be so appreciated! My guess is it would need to be converted to an internal magazine in order to find the most options.

 

[ONE-TEN]

I agree with CF, Recoil with 30-06 is different if shooting say, 220gr pills. I remember those being downright BONE RATTLIN’! But even the 180gr are quite similar to the 270 with 150gr. pills. Then the 280AI which is easily found in loaded ammunition online or bigger firearms stores. It can be found with bullets as light as 140gr., up to 175gr. And much heavier if reloaded.

Also, no need feeling under gunned with either the 270AI or 270Win, up against Elk. A 270 will drop an Elk where it stands!

 

[Paddyd]

If you're using it for deer hunting I'd go with the 3006 over a 270, but only because of its versatility. MANY MANY good bullets available from 110 to 220 grains whereas the 270W, while a fantastic cartridge and extremely lethal on deer is pretty much limited, practically from 100gn to 150 gn bullets, with 130 gn being the norm you'll find in a store. As for the 280 AI, you're limited, at least to my knowledge to handloads as I dont know of factory 280AI ammo.
3006 is available in any Walmart in the country too.

 

[ONE-TEN]

I think my biggest concern with customizing this one is with options for replacement stocks. Any clarity on what options there are for me would be so appreciated! My guess is it would need to be converted to an internal magazine in order to find the most options.

Well, what is it you are looking for? Your picture shows a rather beautiful wood stock. Very nice for its age! So, please give us some more information as to what you are after? You mentioned polymer, however, that’s typically the lowest quality material for a stock. And if you’ve already bedded the Action, your stock isn’t a problem. ESPECIALLY if you Pillar bedded. (Which you can still do even if you already skim bedded.)

From your posts, it sounds like this is to be primarily a hunting rifle for medium to large game? Now, if you simply aren’t fond of wood, let us know. Nothing wrong with that. Quite frankly, Wood is not preference! I am a fan of Aluminum Chassis. But weight is not a factor for me because all my shooting is from a bench.

 

[ONE-TEN]

Here’s a great video from Ron Spomer. He does a great job illustrating 270Win’s effectiveness. I really recommend people research modern ammunition ballistics. Examining a 180gr 30-06 & a 150gr 270, BOTH using the Accubond, the 30-06 has only 100ft.lbs. more energy, get the 270 has higher Ballistic Coefficient & higher Sectional Density. But, in any case.

 

[SevenFan]

Personally I would not want a chassis for packing a hunting rifle in the woods chasing elk. The terrain and cover can be extremely challenging. Likewise on caliber, elk can be incredibly tough to kill, and in that case I want more not less caliber. The '06 with a quality 180gr bullet is just about perfect IMHO.

I'll give the 270 it's due - on the open ground conditions like you might find in AZ, CO, WY but not in the forests of WA, OR, & ID. In the latter case I'd choose the '06 hands down.

I happen to be a big 7mm fan so my primary deer and elk rifle was a 110 in 7RM with my first year of production 110 in 30-06 in the camper as a backup.

The 280AI would be a superb deer and elk round but my hunting days are done, just killing paper and the occasional varmint now.

 

[ONE-TEN]

Here’s something interesting. Not only do the FREELY advertise a HUGE Bull Elk on the Box of ammunition for this brand of 270Win, but look at the ballistics.



150gr Nosler ballistic tip Accubond bullet.

Muzzle Velocity: 2900FPS

Muzzle Ebergy: 2801lbs.

G1 Ballistic Coefficient: 0.625

Sectional Density: 0.279

Please, if anyone can, point to any
30-06 that shows any significant difference.

 

[ONE-TEN]

Personally I would not want a chassis for packing a hunting rifle in the woods chasing elk. The terrain and cover can be extremely challenging. Likewise on caliber, elk can be incredibly tough to kill, and in that case I want more not less caliber. The '06 with a quality 180gr bullet is just about perfect IMHO.

I'll give the 270 it's due - on the open ground conditions like you might find in AZ, CO, WY but not in the forests of WA, OR, & ID. In the latter case I'd choose the '06 hands down.

I happen to be a big 7mm fan so my primary deer and elk rifle was a 110 in 7RM with my first year of production 110 in 30-06 in the camper as a backup.

The 280AI would be a superb deer and elk round but my hunting days are done, just killing paper and the occasional varmint now.

No, I wouldn’t either. Which is why I specified all my shooting is done from the bench. I no longer hunt. Although, it’s not entirely true. Actually, if I WAS still hunting, I would be using this Chassis from MDT. The HNT-26. It’s lighter than ANY Wood stock! Only 26oz.! Almost TOO light! And super STIFF, as well. A lot of money… but if it was my main hunting rig, I wouldn’t mind.

 

[Cgraham97]

My wishlist for the stock is for an adjustable comb height, length of pull, a more vertical grip, and options for mounting a bipod.

I could purchase some Talley mounts for the scope to eliminate the rail and lower the scope right now. I have not pillar bedded the rifle at this point. I enjoy the wood, however, after taking it a few times, I have noticed the outer finish has become pretty brittle and fragile.

I love the wood look, however I am more after function and durability than looks. My plan would be to hang onto the original stock if I wanted to go back to it.

From what I can tell, options for this rifle with the top bolt release, screw spacing, and being a left handed long action with a detachable magazine leave me with fewer options.

 

[KMW1954]

I currently own 3 Savage actions, and none are in factory condition. I have 2 in Boyd's stocks, 1 in a Richards Microfit stock and yet another Richards stock I am working on.

If I were to build one for hunting today, I believe I would be looking at one of the new caliber offerings, such as the 7mm PRC. As I work weekly at a large outdoor range, actually on the range, I am seeing more and more of these PRC calibers.

 

[KMW1954]

My wishlist for the stock is for an adjustable comb height, length of pull, a more vertical grip, and options for mounting a bipod.

From what I can tell, options for this rifle with the top bolt release, screw spacing, and being a left handed long action with a detachable magazine leave me with fewer options.

I love my Richards Microfit stocks. which is why I am building another.

The drawback with these is that they are not drop-in ready. They do require a good deal of work but they do also offer a very good variety of models and qualities or grades of wood, along with the laminates.

These are my 2.

The bottom stock is going to be a bench rifle stock. When finished it will have one of these; https://atlasworxs.com/shop/atlasworxs-adjustable-cheek-comb-riser/ and one of these; https://stockpositioning.com/produc...ustable-lop-pad-plate-black-stock-positioning

 

[ONE-TEN]

My wishlist for the stock is for an adjustable comb height, length of pull, a more vertical grip, and options for mounting a bipod.

I could purchase some Talley mounts for the scope to eliminate the rail and lower the scope right now. I have not pillar bedded the rifle at this point. I enjoy the wood, however, after taking it a few times, I have noticed the outer finish has become pretty brittle and fragile.

I love the wood look, however I am more after function and durability than looks. My plan would be to hang onto the original stock if I wanted to go back to it.

From what I can tell, options for this rifle with the top bolt release, screw spacing, and being a left handed long action with a detachable magazine leave me with fewer options.

Go with a Boyd’s At-One stock. Has Adjustable LOP & COMB height. They are an incredible value. Yours is a 110 Top Bolt Release & Left Hand Bolt, Long Action, Staggerfeed, Blind Magazine.
https://www.boydsgunstocks.com/product-configurator

They have many different colors, but I prefer the Pepper Laminate. If I liked Wood stocks, this is the one I would use.

 

[Paddyd]

Paddy, you know I love ya pard, but I have to take contention here. Some of what you said just isn’t really Ballistically, or historically sound. In reality, given the proper bullet, whatever a 30-06 can ethically kill, a 270Win will ethically kill. Remember… we are entitled to PREFER a 30-06 but we aren’t entitled to facts, based on preference.

Here’s a great video from Ron Spomer. He does a great job illustrating 270Win’s effectiveness. I really recommend people brush research modern ammunition ballistics. Examining a 180gr 30-06 & a 150gr 270, BOTH using the Accubond, the 30-06 has only 100ft.lbs. more energy, get the 270 has higher Ballistic Coefficient & higher Sectional Density. But, in any case.

All I said was the 3006 had more choice of bullets than the 270. I've owned both for 35 yrs and load for both. Never said a the 270 wasnt a great killer of game so I question your reading comprehension fundamentals.

 

[Cgraham97]

Go with a Boyd’s At-One stock. Has Adjustable LOP & COMB height. They are an incredible value. Yours is a 110 Top Bolt Release & Left Hand Bolt, Long Action, Staggerfeed, Blind Magazine.
https://www.boydsgunstocks.com/product-configurator

They have many different colors, but I prefer the Pepper Laminate. If I liked Wood stocks, this is the one I would use.

It's a sweet looking stock for sure! I wonder what the weight on those would be.

I am assuming the bottom metal is included with this? I have read where guys will convert their old side release detachable magazines into blind magazines and am wondering if it would work in this situation. This is the link to the Facebook thread:



Curious to hear your thoughts!

 

[ONE-TEN]

Some others here know a bit more on the older Staggerfeed Magazine, and Blind Mag parts. I know there are several parts that coincide with the mag box attached to the Action. I prefer the Centerfeed, and even if I happened to have a Staggerfeed, I would get rid of the Mag Box attached to the Action convert to Centerfeed.

 

[ONE-TEN]

It's a sweet looking stock for sure! I wonder what the weight on those would be.

I am assuming the bottom metal is included with this? I have read where guys will convert their old side release detachable magazines into blind magazines and am wondering if it would work in this situation. This is the link to the Facebook thread:



Curious to hear your thoughts!

I’ve not done that, but the idea is sound.

 

[ONE-TEN]

All I said was the 3006 had more choice of bullets than the 270. I've owned both for 35 yrs and load for both. Never said a the 270 wasnt a great killer of game so I question your reading comprehension fundamentals.

You’re right. My apologies.
Post edited.

 

[SevenFan]

I love my Richards Microfit stocks. which is why I am building another.

The drawback with these is that they are not drop-in ready. They do require a good deal of work but they do also offer a very good variety of models and qualities or grades of wood, along with the laminates.

Very nice finish work!

 

[Fjold]

Everyone has given you some good advice. Just some opinions:

Go with the stainless, Shilen, Criterion or PacNor in whatever groove arrangement that you like. I prefer an odd number of lands and grooves since they distort/compress the bullet less than an even number of grooves. An odd number of grooves has a land opposite a groove while an even number of grooves have lands opposite each other.

There's nothing wrong with a properly bedded wood stock. My serious big game hunting rifles are wood or laminate.

The 30.06 offers you the most versatility since you're aiming for antelope and elk. Load the Barnes 130 grain TTSX at 3,300 fps and you have a flat shooting antelope rig with less recoil than the 150 - 180 grain bullets. Load it with any premium quality 180 grain bullet for a hammer for elk.

Go lefties!
I mostly hunt with my single shot rifles now but still have a few lefty bolt guns

 

[Cgraham97]

Everyone has given you some good advice. Just some opinions:

Go with the stainless, Shilen, Criterion or PacNor in whatever groove arrangement that you like. I prefer an odd number of lands and grooves since they distort/compress the bullet less than an even number of grooves. An odd number of grooves has a land opposite a groove while an even number of grooves have lands opposite each other.

There's nothing wrong with a properly bedded wood stock. My serious big game hunting rifles are wood or laminate.

The 30.06 offers you the most versatility since you're aiming for antelope and elk. Load the Barnes 130 grain TTSX at 3,300 fps and you have a flat shooting antelope rig with less recoil than the 150 - 180 grain bullets. Load it with any premium quality 180 grain bullet for a hammer for elk.

Go lefties!
I mostly hunt with my single shot rifles now but still have a few lefty bolt guns

Im not sure I’ve seen that many lefty bolt actions in one collection before .

I have thought about the 130ttsx in a 30-06 and love the idea! However, I am not a reloader at the moment. Budget and time both being prohibitive factors. I wish Barnes would make a full powered 130gr. load as I would love to try it! Right now, they just have it in a reduced recoil offering.

 

[Cgraham97]

Some others here know a bit more on the older Staggerfeed Magazine, and Blind Mag parts. I know there are several parts that coincide with the mag box attached to the Action. I prefer the Centerfeed, and even if I happened to have a Staggerfeed, I would get rid of the Mag Box attached to the Action convert to Centerfeed.

From some quick research, it looks like the action screw spacing would be the same, however it would require milling out more of a relief in the action to create space to insert the magazine. That would be a little more invasive than I think I want to get. With the equipment I have available.